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Podcast: Utilizing Dying as Motivation to Reside

Podcast: Using Death as Motivation to Live

How usually do you consider demise? If you happen to’re like most individuals, you in all probability attempt to maintain it within the again corners of your thoughts. However in response to right now’s visitor, Kate Manser, remembering you would possibly die tomorrow is the perfect inspiration to stay right now. Kate asserts that after we incorporate a sure degree of mortality consciousness into our day by day lives, it motivates us to worth life a lot extra and to stay every day with intention. We begin to discover pleasure within the small issues and stay in a manner that makes a optimistic outward ripple for all of humanity.

So how will we handle to consider demise with out falling into worry? Tune into right now’s Psych Central podcast to listen to Kate’s journey and the way we will all stay life to the fullest.


Visitor data for ‘Kate Manser- Dying as Motivation’ Podcast Episode

At 30 years outdated, Kate Manser realized an necessary reality: Remembering that you simply would possibly die tomorrow is the perfect inspiration to stay right now. After experiencing this radical shift in perspective, Kate stop her job at Google to construct YOU MIGHT DIE TOMORROW, her motion to encourage individuals at all ages to essentially stay earlier than they die. 

If you happen to keep in mind just one factor about Kate, let or not it’s this: she is simply so glad to be alive. Discover extra of her work at

About The Psych Central Podcast Host

Gabe Howard is an award-winning author and speaker who lives with bipolar dysfunction. He’s the writer of the favored e-book, Psychological Sickness is an Asshole and different Observations, obtainable from Amazon; signed copies are additionally obtainable straight from the writer. To study extra about Gabe, please go to his web site,

Laptop Generated Transcript for ‘Kate Manser- Dying as Motivation’ Episode

Editor’s Word: Please be conscious that this transcript has been pc generated and due to this fact might comprise inaccuracies and grammar errors. Thanks.

Announcer: You’re listening to the Psych Central Podcast, the place visitor consultants within the area of psychology and psychological well being share thought-provoking data utilizing plain, on a regular basis language. Right here’s your host, Gabe Howard.

Gabe Howard: Welcome to this week’s episode of the Psych Central Podcast. Calling into the present right now we have now Kate Manser. At 30 years outdated, Kate realized an necessary reality, remembering that you simply would possibly die tomorrow is the perfect inspiration to stay right now. After experiencing this radical shift in perspective, Kate stop her job at Google to construct YOU MIGHT DIE TOMORROW, her motion to encourage individuals at all ages to essentially stay earlier than they die. Kate, welcome to the present.

Kate Manser: Gabe, glad right now.

Gabe Howard: Oh, thanks a lot for being right here. Now, right now we’re going to debate demise or are we going to debate life? How do you see it?

Kate Manser: Completely, yeah. I imply, it’s all form of intertwined. You may’t have a dialog about demise with out additionally having a dialog about life. And likewise often at that desk is a dialog about worry and/or anxiousness in addition to which means.

Gabe Howard: Within the preparation for the present, I stored seeing, , demise over and again and again. And at first it was slightly overwhelming, like, why couldn’t or not it’s referred to as “You would possibly stay tomorrow?” You already know, demise simply has such a unfavourable connotation to it. And actually, I feel most of us would agree that demise is unfavourable. How do you wrap your thoughts round you really being an extremely optimistic individual?

Kate Manser: Sure, completely. I’m a particularly optimistic individual, and it’s a few various things. Primary, which is dealing with your fears, it’s a model of publicity remedy. So I really went by means of a yr of actually intense demise anxiousness the place I used to be afraid of demise on a regular basis. Each time I bought within the automobile, each time I laid down to fall asleep, I might have motion pictures enjoying in my head that my mother died or how I died. And so, what broke that for me was realizing I’ve one life, I’m going to die it doesn’t matter what. I can both embrace that reality and use it as my motivation to stay, or I can simply waste my life persevering with in worry.

Gabe Howard: This does beg the query; how do you face your worry of demise?

Kate Manser: Very rigorously and each single day. And the factor is, that once more, if we’re enthusiastic about worry, life, demise and which means once more, they’re all form of sitting at this dinner desk. Nobody’s ever going to rise up from that desk, proper? Like worry is at all times gonna be related to demise. Dying is at all times going to be related to life. And we’re at all times looking for some which means amongst all of it. And so, I’ve not overcome my worry of demise. I’m afraid of demise. And I’ll at all times proceed to be. However what I’ve accomplished is accepted the fact of my mortality to some extent the place I’m not actively in worry of it each day. And what has occurred is that I’ve discovered that it’s my greatest motivation to stay, as a result of I don’t find out about you, Gabe, however I work greatest on deadlines. And so, I’m a procrastinator and I’ll procrastinate on life for ceaselessly and until I’m 80, 90 years outdated, if hopefully I get there. After which abruptly, I look again and I’m like, shoot. I lackadaisically lived my life. And so residing as if the deadline is tomorrow for me is the perfect drugs for a procrastinator.

Gabe Howard: One of many issues that you simply mentioned is discovering which means in life, and the very first thing that form of popped into my head is we have now an actual drawback discovering which means as a result of it’s kind of subjective, proper? Some individuals discover which means in caring for their canine. However different persons are like, properly, no, until I remedy most cancers, my life has no which means. How do you discover which means in your life, particularly the large issues versus the on a regular basis issues?

Kate Manser: So I’ll reply that query. However simply backing up slightly bit to form of get in the direction of that, which is in case you examine the psychology of mortality consciousness and the psychology of worry typically, the 2 greatest methods to mitigate or decrease your worry of demise are, primary, publicity remedy. So gently invite mortality into your life by reclassifying demise as not morbid, however a pure a part of life. There’s all these Instagram accounts you can comply with, books you may learn. And even simply observing demise and endings in your life will help you recondition that response from worry and this like connotation of morbidity to once more, that on a regular basis truth of life. And the second-best option to mitigate your worry of demise is to stay meaningfully as a result of, OK, certain, dying is horrifying. It’s mysterious. We don’t know. However a maybe greater worry is dying having not lived. Proper? Dying, having not lived, having wasted our life. And so, by residing in alignment with our which means, no matter that subjective which means is, such as you mentioned, we will decrease our worry of demise. Effectively, how do you reside meaningfully? I don’t know. No person actually is aware of. And I feel it’s actually traumatic to attempt to, like, stay your higher goal in life. So what I do is I simply attempt to get pleasure from my life each single day. And I consider that on the finish of my life, if I’ve loved my life, I can’t solely not remorse my life, however I’ll have created a optimistic influence which can also be significant to me.

Gabe Howard: I like every little thing that you simply mentioned, however there’s additionally this a part of me that simply instantly was like, properly, so as to love my life, I wish to stop my job, I wish to promote my home. I wish to principally so as to discover pleasure in my life, I feel I should be independently rich. And naturally, I’m not independently rich. And I seen even whilst you had been speaking, I used to be getting caught on this suggestions loop the place I used to be like, oh, properly, I can’t try this as a result of I’ve to work. 

Kate Manser: Yeah.

Gabe Howard: I can’t try this as a result of I’ve to care for my spouse. Oh, I’ve household obligations. And I think about that a whole lot of our listeners are considering, properly, that is nonsense. You simply can’t have pleasure on a regular basis. What do you say to that?

Kate Manser: Effectively, what I can inform you is that, I had what I contemplate, I assume, a religious awakening, which is after I realized and completely modified my perspective on demise, that opened me up and made me care much less about what different individuals suppose, made me worth time extra, made me wish to prioritize having fun with my life. And the opposite factor that I did as soon as I had that religious awakening was I did stop my job. I did journey world wide for 2 years. And what occurred on the finish after I after the 2 years I used to be touring and every little thing was nice was I ran out of cash and I needed to come again to common life. I needed to get an everyday job, get an everyday house. And what I noticed in that complete expertise is that large, significant issues, such as you mentioned, turning into independently rich, quitting your job, beginning a enterprise, having children, no matter that’s for you. These are necessary. And you’ll keep in mind these on the finish of your life. And I can virtually assure that you’ll seemingly remorse not having tried these large significant issues. However what I noticed when the mud settled after my religious awakening and quitting the job and touring world wide is that that have fades and exhilaration fades. However what I discovered is that my new path in life and my new thought of what residing such as you would possibly die tomorrow is, is discovering these small, significant issues that deliver pleasure to our on a regular basis life. Like trying up at a blue sky and simply smiling and feeling your aliveness, listening to the sound of your partner or your children snort, like actually actually stopping to scent the flowers, having fun with the style of your espresso. Like these are the small, significant issues that can make up, each in amount and high quality, the higher enjoyment of your life.

Gabe Howard: A lot of what you mentioned, they simply sound like actually tough and difficult selections that folks need to make of their lives, and you’ve got one thing referred to as the demise mattress intestine test. I’m very to listen to what that’s.

Kate Manser: So the demise mattress intestine test is one thing that I simply began naturally doing after I realized how clear your perspective on life is once you have a look at it from the attitude of your demise. So there’s one thing about being on the finish of your life. Once more, you don’t actually care what individuals suppose. You may have this sense of authenticity. You may have a transparent perspective on what’s and isn’t necessary to you. However I don’t wish to wait till I’m lifeless or on my deathbed to have the ability to have that clear perspective on my life. So what I do is after I’m confronted with a choice in life, and this might be one thing so simple as what ought to I do right now to one thing as large as ought to I stop my job or ought to I’ve children or ought to I’m going skydiving? And we will form of do that collectively, which is you consider a troublesome resolution that you simply’re dealing with in your life and also you shut your eyes and also you think about your self from the attitude of being in your deathbed and also you’re trying again on the current second. So you will have your resolution you talked about. How would I really feel trying again on this resolution on the finish of my life if I selected possibility A? And also you observe how you are feeling in your intestine. Perhaps you are feeling a sinking feeling that you’ve got taken the incorrect path. Perhaps you are feeling a lightness of being and like a happiness that you simply did one thing that you simply felt was in alignment along with your sense of which means. And possibly you repeat that having chosen possibility B or nonetheless many choices you will have. However once more, this attitude of being on the finish of your life, the entire judgment, worry, fear simply slides away and we’re left with this clear perspective. And so the deathbed intestine test lets you entry that clear perspective whilst you’re alive.

Gabe Howard: In a manner, it sounds quite a bit such as you’re saying that it’s important to stay with intention. I feel many people simply form of pinball from from one disaster or one trip or one work day or one second to the subsequent. And there’s no intention. While you’re contemplating how this resolution goes to really feel once you’re in your deathbed, that appears very, very intentional to me.

Kate Manser: Oh, completely. And I give it some thought when it comes to provide and demand. Proper? When we have now an overabundance of a commodity, no matter it’s, the worth goes down and we care much less about it. Proper? When the worth of gasoline is low, you go to any outdated gasoline station that’s wherever. However when the worth of gasoline is excessive, you worth it extra and also you’re gonna hunt down the very best worth that you will discover for that. And that’s what residing such as you would possibly die tomorrow does, it places life within the perspective of a restricted provide, which then raises the perceived worth which causes you to stay extra deliberately. As a result of in case you suppose you’re going to stay to all eighty seven years of American life expectancy, like the provision is nice and due to this fact the worth is decrease. However in case you have a look at your life as a really, very restricted time provide, the worth skyrockets and all of the sudden each second is that this excessive worth reward.

Gabe Howard: I’m nonetheless very hung up on this idea of how can demise be motivation to stay? I’m beginning to perceive it. And naturally, , demise is one thing that all of us faux that we’re not going to do. 

Kate Manser: Mm-hmm.

Gabe Howard: For no matter purpose, all of us suppose that we’re going to stay ceaselessly, despite the fact that that’s statistically unattainable. However you will have turned demise right into a motivation which is extremely intriguing. However are you able to drill down even farther on how demise may be motivation to stay? 

Kate Manser: I feel it’s completely different for everybody, like so for me, enthusiastic about demise once more places life in that restricted provide, which thereby raises the worth. It additionally offers me a way of readability on my life. Like I mentioned, in order that once more raises the worth and once more, simply considering the truth that demise is one thing that’s going to occur to each single one among us. Proper? You may come to phrases with it otherwise you can not. I choose a life during which I do come to phrases with it. And it causes you to consider your life in a really completely different manner and considering that your life will go on and on and on ceaselessly with, , this immortal form of mindset, such as you simply mentioned, once more, that worth goes down. And I need a life that I really feel alive. I need a life that I get pleasure from moments and keep in mind doing issues that I be ok with. I’m additionally like a egocentric and egotistical individual, like all people else. And like, after I do die, I would like butts in seats at that funeral. I would like individuals to really feel an area the place I’ve gone. A part of residing such as you would possibly die tomorrow is realizing that we create our legacy each single day. And so, if you wish to be remembered as nice, it’s important to stay as nice. If you would like individuals to overlook you once you’re gone, it’s important to stay in a manner right now that makes them miss you if you end up gone. And so, for me, that’s form of a egocentric and egotistical factor. However I don’t actually care the motivation, no matter it takes to inspire me to stay an excellent life. I embrace.

Gabe Howard: Kate, the sentiment you would possibly die tomorrow, it appears actually form of harsh. How do you soften that?

Kate Manser: Sometimes, my model is you would possibly die tomorrow in large letters after which under that, however a lot smaller, it says so stay right now. And for most individuals who’ve this type of ingrained worry of demise, which the worry of demise is common. So there’s at all times going to be worry. However that “so stay right now” on the backside simply actually helps individuals embrace the message of you would possibly die tomorrow. There are such a lot of those who take into consideration demise and there’s so many individuals that both had a near-death expertise or have had a traumatic loss of their life. And it’s brought about them to have a look at life in another way. Folks will discuss to me about how that they had misplaced somebody of their lives. You already know, their mother had died and so they had been residing in another way ever since. And now they’ve lastly seen a saying that helps them put a framework to their new outlook on life. I’ve gotten feedback like that is essentially the most motivating sticker I’ve ever seen on one among my runs. Lastly, somebody is speaking about demise in a motivating manner. I’ve 1000’s and 1000’s of followers that they’re determined for somebody to lastly deliver demise out of the darkness and into the sunshine and be reminded that all of us must get up and notice that our life is a restricted time provide.  

Gabe Howard: We shall be proper again after these messages.

Sponsor Message: Hey of us, Gabe right here. I host one other podcast for Psych Central. It’s referred to as Not Loopy. He hosts Not Loopy with me, Jackie Zimmerman, and it’s all about navigating our lives with psychological sickness and psychological well being issues. Pay attention now at Psych or in your favourite podcast participant.

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Gabe Howard: We’re again discussing the way you would possibly die tomorrow with Kate Manser. Let’s discuss your story for a second. You’ve form of described it as you wakened at some point and also you realized that you can die, in order that ended positively. What’s the lengthy model?

Kate Manser: Sure. I imply, the lengthy model is that I used to be identical to all people else. I by no means actually considered demise in any respect. I simply assumed that I might stay ceaselessly, stay to be 90 and. However what occurred was in 2014, within the span of six months, I had three of my buddies die who had been round my similar age simply from random, surprising tragedies. My boss at Google, he was on trip and died when he was leaping into the water. A pal of mine from faculty died strolling throughout the road. She was hit by a drunk driver. And a member of the family of mine died from aggressive renal most cancers at 35. In order that was what despatched me into that yr of demise anxiousness. And I feel lots of people undergo a interval in our life the place we’re kind of consumed by the worry of demise and the mysteriousness of it. And it was to the purpose that it took over my life and I used to be not having fun with my life as a result of I used to be continuously preoccupied with demise. And what lastly snapped me out of that unexpectedly was a fourth pal of mine died. He was climbing Mount Everest, my pal Dan Fredinburg, and he died when the Nepal earthquake struck within the spring of 2015, which triggered an avalanche on the mountain.

Kate Manser: And his demise brought about me to have a look at my life and be like, Kate, you’re afraid of driving by means of an intersection. You may have allowed the worry of demise to take over your life. And right here’s your superb courageous pal residing out his most genuine life. You already know, I might die climbing Everest. I might die within the intersection that I’m afraid of, or I might die climbing the steps. And I simply realized I didn’t wish to expend my valuable life, time and vitality in worry. And I might slightly spend my life vitality residing my absolute best most vibrant life. And often, after somebody dies, it’s like, oh, hug your children tighter, name your mother. However that at all times fades. However why can’t we have now that perspective for our whole life? And in order that’s actually what shifted for me. After which quickly after that, I had a realization the place I used to be like, I don’t need to comply with the blueprint. I can stay the life that I would like. I might go stay on a ship; I might transfer to Japan. I noticed that I’ve autonomy over my life. And all of this happened across the age of thirty for me. And so now I take into consideration demise each day. And I don’t wish to die. I at all times could have worry. However I see demise as my biggest motivation to stay whereas I’m nonetheless kickin.

Gabe Howard: That’s simply a fully unimaginable story. And I’m so sorry on your loss. I don’t suppose anyone can take heed to your story and in addition not really feel dangerous along with feeling optimistic that you simply had like a religious awakening. That’s a whole lot of demise to beat and in a comparatively brief time frame. Did you will have any unfavourable results from that?

Kate Manser: Oh, yeah, completely. So, I imply, I went by means of that yr of intense demise anxiousness the place that was not a option to stay, however in my analysis of all of this afterwards. You already know, we’ve all heard of PTSD, post-traumatic stress dysfunction.

Gabe Howard: Mm-hmm. Sure.

Kate Manser: We’re very aware of what that appears like. What are a few of the issues that trigger that? Actually, loss and grief is completely a set off for PTSD. However what I realized in my analysis is that there’s one other side of that referred to as PTG, post-traumatic development. And it’s not an either-or. It’s not like, oh, you will have a traumatic expertise and both you get PTSD or you will have this PTG, post-traumatic development. They will each happen. And once more, psychology isn’t linear. And so what I feel occurred to me was that I skilled these deaths, I went by means of some PTSD, I assume, after which by means of that, I used to be in a position to form of circulate into post-traumatic development. What occurs in PTG is your life will get jumbled up by an expertise. Sometimes, a really unfavourable traumatic expertise after which assimilate and readjust your new life and probably change your views and develop. And I feel it’s a typical factor. Proper? This concept of going by means of a tough time and popping out higher and stronger after a interval of actually tough grief or arduous occasions. And so what occurred to me was that I used to be in a position to once more, reframe demise from being this terrifying factor that was taking on my life to demise is the non-negotiable. Proper? That factor is stationary. It’s going to occur. I don’t know when. What’s malleable is my response to it. And so I made a decision to make my response one among productiveness. And I feel after we have a look at demise, you may both reply with apathy, proper? We’re going to die. Life is meaningless. Or you may reply with anxiousness, which is what I did, which is to stay in worry of demise. Or you may reply with motion. And I’m glad that I lastly bought to that time of productive motion. I’m not particular. I consider that everybody can get to that time.

Gabe Howard: And the way does one get to that time, how will we get away of that apathy?

Kate Manser: Effectively, I feel a message such as you would possibly die tomorrow and realizing that demise goes to occur and that we have now the power and the ability to decide on our response to that’s, I feel, an amazing begin. And again from the start of the present after we had been speaking in regards to the two methods to mitigate the worry of demise. The primary is simply usually incorporating that mortality consciousness into your life and making an attempt to alter your perspective on it’s the first option to mitigate that worry, that publicity remedy. After which the second manner is to simply stay your greatest life. Have enjoyable. Take moments to essentially admire being alive and revel in your self. And collectively, these moments will add as much as a life that you’ll be glad to have led at any time when the time comes so that you can die.

Gabe Howard: Why do you suppose this has resonated with so many individuals?  How do individuals often reply?

Kate Manser: I don’t know what it’s, Gabe, as a result of after I first began it, I mentioned this radically modified my life for the higher. I wish to share this with different individuals. And I had no thought. I simply began this as a weblog. I had no concept that it could flip into the motion or revolution or no matter you wish to name it right now. And I’m certain some individuals simply give it the. That’s morbid or I want I didn’t see that. However there’s additionally so many individuals that message me each single day and say, this has modified my life and I’m lastly awake.

Gabe Howard: Kate, thanks a lot for being right here, what are your closing phrases for our listeners? As a result of we coated quite a bit and at the same time as I’m sitting right here, I’m like, oh, that’s very optimistic. After which I feel, oh, that’s scary and that’s demise. And I actually don’t know what our listeners are considering, however I can inform you, I simply, each time demise comes up, there’s this sense in my chest. And whereas I’m listening to your phrases and intellectually, I used to be like, that is a wonderful level. That’s superb. I nonetheless have this, like, intestine test. That’s like, ohh dangerous, ohh dangerous.

Kate Manser: Yeah.

Gabe Howard: What are your ideas on that?

Kate Manser: So psychologist Dr. Irvin D. Yalom wrote this glorious e-book that I like to recommend that’s geared towards each the layman in addition to the psychologist. It’s referred to as Staring on the Solar. And he’s an existential psychologist. He’s I imply, I feel he’s in his 90s now. He’s nonetheless doing fantastic work. And in his e-book, he says that in his complete profession of speaking with sufferers which have issues of their life and/or worry of demise, the best manner that he has discovered to be an antidote to the worry of demise is the idea of rippling. The concept of rippling is that what we do in our lives, particularly, good issues, they create ripples or the butterfly impact, as many people is likely to be aware of, that can proceed to ripple out far past not solely our, the individuals in our life, however far past even our existence in our personal life. So the great that we do in our life, the optimistic life that we select to guide, will create your legacy and that optimistic legacy of ripples that can proceed to exit lengthy after you’re gone. And once more, that may be a lovely manner that we will keep in mind that how we stay issues, how we method our day issues, how we discuss to the clerk on the nook retailer issues. We create optimistic ripples each single day. And that creates that legacy of goodness that I feel all of us, at our core, actually need. And so simply get pleasure from your life, have enjoyable, really feel alive. And that’s the greatest option to create a optimistic legacy for your self on the earth.

Gabe Howard: Kate, thanks a lot for being right here. The place can of us discover you on-line and the place can they get your e-book?

Kate Manser: Sure, completely, I’m so excited to lastly deliver this e-book into the world, the title of the e-book is similar because the model and the motion. YOU MIGHT DIE TOMORROW, SO LIVE TODAY. You’ll find it on Amazon, Barnes & Noble. You’ll find the audio e-book on Audible and I’ve my hub on the place I do writings and interviews. And I’d like to get you a sticker and you may get T-shirts and all that great things to remind you to have enjoyable each single day.

Gabe Howard: Kate, thanks once more for being right here and thanks all for listening. Do you want this present? Please subscribe, rank, assessment. If you happen to share us on social media, use your phrases. Inform individuals why you preferred it and why they need to hear. And keep in mind, you may get one week of free, handy, reasonably priced, personal on-line counseling anytime, wherever, just by visiting We are going to see all people subsequent week.

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